Episode 119: In Business with Family:How to Balance Work, Life and Relationships
14th July, 2025
Working with family can be a beautiful blend of trust and shared purpose—but it can also bring unique challenges. In this episode, we unpack the realities of being in business with your spouse, siblings, parents, or kids. From defining clear roles and setting boundaries, to managing conflict and planning for the future, we explore how to keep both the business—and the family—strong. Whether you're already in a family business or considering it, this episode is packed with real talk and practical tips.
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Podcast Transcript Available Here
Trudi Cowan (00:09.23) Hello everyone and welcome back to the Financial Fofu podcast. Today we are talking doing business with your family.
Sarah Eifermann (00:17.04) Fun times.
Trudi Cowan (00:19.584) It is fun times. And look, it can be fun times. It can also be not so fun times.
Sarah Eifermann (00:26.126) Yeah, so today's episode is about how do you balance work, life, relationships, maybe you're in business with your partner or your husband or your wife, and that can have a really, what's the word, challenging implication on relationships if communication isn't a strong point for you.
Trudi Cowan (00:31.424) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (00:41.41) Mmm.
Trudi Cowan (00:46.006) Yeah, but it could also be family with your dad or your siblings or your in-laws, which all have the potential for sort of conflict, some blurred lines, maybe some emotional baggage being brought into the workplace.
Sarah Eifermann (00:50.318) Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yep.
Sarah Eifermann (01:00.339) Well, perhaps as well, like, yeah, you took the words out of my mouth, like, you know, and also, like, what do they say, familiarity breeds contempt, like, as in how you might speak to a family member versus how you would speak to anybody else in life, potentially.
Trudi Cowan (01:10.222) Yeah
Trudi Cowan (01:16.0) Yes, but the reality is there are a huge number of family businesses in Australia and one of the reasons is because we feel like we can trust our family. There is a sense of loyalty and often shared values which make it really appealing and can make it really attractive to want to go into business with a family member.
Sarah Eifermann (01:22.232) Mm-mm. Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (01:27.022) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (01:32.261) Yeah.
Yeah, can be really powerful combination to create success as well.
Trudi Cowan (01:38.317) Yeah.
Yeah, and we've certainly seen it with some of our clients as well. We're working with your family can work really well.
Sarah Eifermann (01:44.154) Mm-hmm.
Yeah, absolutely. So, I mean, the thing with family businesses though, they do have the issue for conflict. And usually when conflict occurs, it's big because of what it is. and so today's episode is how we can really work around or work with those complicated mixes to ensure the best outcome and highest outcome for everybody concerned. And so maybe some things you haven't considered or some action tips and tools that you can implement.
Trudi Cowan (01:55.213) Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (02:11.585) yet.
Sarah Eifermann (02:16.858) to really ensure that the relationship stays a primary priority whilst you do business.
Trudi Cowan (02:22.732) Yeah, yeah. And look, I think number one thing that has to happen is you need to have clear roles and expectations within the business. Who is doing what? Who is in charge of which aspects of the business? How are decisions going to be made? Do you have an equal vote? Does one person get a weighted vote? What is the reasoning for that? What happens when you have a deadlock between your votes? Is there a...
Sarah Eifermann (02:38.106) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (02:51.844) Mediator, pointed mediator. I do a lot of mediation work, I will say, between family-based businesses. It's very interesting to see what people think or feel or how they respond to certain circumstances. And sometimes you just need a third party to make the decision or to point you to the decision.
Trudi Cowan (02:52.916) Yeah. Have a look. Yes, I think we do. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (03:11.618) Yeah, sometimes you do. And look, when I say that we need sort of clear roles and expectations, I'm not talking about sort of unspoken, he does this, I do that kind of stuff. I'm talking about have it written down. There's a clear plan. You have a title that reflects your role and it is very clear, documented kind of process within your business, not just a, we're working with the vibe.
Sarah Eifermann (03:29.136) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (03:36.984) One of the common misconceptions that I find more so with husband and wife businesses than with maybe father, son or mother, daughter or mother, son businesses is a lack of appreciation and understanding for what the other person does all day. And to be honest, it's mainly where one person is an operator or a technician or the technical specialist and the other person is the administrator and the operator doesn't
Trudi Cowan (03:42.796) Hmm
Trudi Cowan (03:53.591) Yep.
Trudi Cowan (04:04.099) Yes.
Sarah Eifermann (04:06.372) believe that the administrator does anything because they don't see it. But then the bills get paid, the planning gets done, the taxes get organized, but apparently they're not doing anything all day. Yep. And then you add on top of that, the obligations to a family life as well, that they're usually doing that as well. So if you're the income producer, but not,
Trudi Cowan (04:08.886) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (04:17.646) Yep. Quotes go out. Let's get changed.
Trudi Cowan (04:29.955) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (04:35.012) the administrator of that income revenue, income and revenue or revenue, I should say, like maybe have a good hard look at what you do every day. And then the other person in that scenario gets to write down everything they do. And that exercise has worked fantastically for any time there has been conflict in perception as to what the other person has been doing, because the bottom line is that they have no fucking idea how much the other person does just in the role for the business.
Trudi Cowan (04:55.16) Hmm.
Trudi Cowan (05:00.353) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (05:04.46) let alone then you add the family life commitments. You'll often find the parent that is the state owned parent, whether they're the mother or the father, are the ones that are doing most of the cooking, the cleaning, the housework, the kids drop off, pick up, organization, managing the calendar, managing the finances and the budget. And then they're running the business as well in the back end.
Trudi Cowan (05:19.502) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (05:26.926) Yeah, and that's where it is important to not just what is our role within the business but also what are each of roles within the family and are we sharing that load appropriately across both of those aspects of our life.
Sarah Eifermann (05:31.492) Yes.
Sarah Eifermann (05:37.626) So here's the thing. Once you've had that communication and you've, you've unpacked the clear roles and the expectation, the next thing that you can do is ensure that you've got some solid boundaries around work. And the boundaries are the harder ones to enforce because sometimes you can't help yourself. I'm just going to send that invoice or I'm just going to do that quote, or I'm just going to call that client back. a lot of people say to me, are you always working? The answer is no. But in my earlier days, yes, I used to work.
Trudi Cowan (05:41.422) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (05:47.395) Yes.
Trudi Cowan (05:55.487) Especially when you work from home.
Sarah Eifermann (06:06.736) from 8 a.m. until 8.30 at night, and then my brain was always on. I had hypnotherapy once for a while, and she said to me, Sarah, when do you turn off? And I was like, when I'm on an international long haul fight with no wifi? That was a massive moment in time for me. Right? But you can't sustain that long term. You can sustain it for a shorter period of time.
Trudi Cowan (06:20.661) Hahaha
Great or ideal.
Sarah Eifermann (06:31.512) And the younger you are, the time period is usually longer as you get older. But as you get older, you realize it's not everything. Like I will work on a weekend.
Trudi Cowan (06:38.786) Yeah. But those boundaries are really important so that you're not having boardroom meetings on the middle of a Sunday when you should be spending time with your kids or you're not having your dad ring you at eight o'clock in the evening when you're trying to relax with your spouse to talk about work stuff. It's not just boundaries within a, between spouse, it's between any of those family members. Once I leave the office, unless it's an emergency, I'm now on family time.
Sarah Eifermann (06:48.357) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (07:05.729) Yeah, it's home time. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (07:07.262) time and I'm spending time with my family and doing things with my family when I'm in my work hours, well then yes, we can have those conversations around work actually.
Sarah Eifermann (07:14.682) Yeah. And, and also it's important to be present in your family, right? And you can't, it's, well, you'd have to be very brilliant to be able to do both very well all of the time. So it's not usually that those people have those gifts, like to be both places mentally in two places, but still present in both doing both really well all the time. So maybe that is that you need to be able to say, okay, I've got to do scheduling or I've got to plan out the day, or I've got to get a quote out.
Trudi Cowan (07:27.788) Hmm. Yeah, yeah, very not easy.
Sarah Eifermann (07:43.632) So I'm going to come home at 5.30 and from 5.30 to eight o'clock, I'm going to be in with my family. And then from eight till nine, I am going to spend that extra hour and the family can then respect that, that that's why, and that's how it works. But if you've got no boundary or schedule or allocation of time to that, they're just going to come and interrupt you constantly, which means that work's going to take five times as long because they need you in their life. Like, isn't that the purpose? Why are you in business?
Trudi Cowan (08:09.634) Yeah, exactly right. And look, may, and maybe one of those boundaries is I have a work phone. I only answer the work phone between these hours. If you're ringing me on my personal phone, then you better be ringing me about a personal matter.
Sarah Eifermann (08:21.56) Hmm. Yeah, absolutely. So my phone goes on Do Not Disturb and has for many, many years and I only... Yeah, because you're in my favorites, which is how you bypass it. You don't get sent to voicemail automatically. I can...
Trudi Cowan (08:27.908) yeah, I've worked out how to bypass that.
Trudi Cowan (08:37.944) I if it's a work call, I don't have to not disturb, but I'm very good at if you're ringing me outside of my work hours, I will just not answer the phone. You can go to voice message mail and I will ring you back when I'm.
Sarah Eifermann (08:45.774) Yeah. In the morning. Yeah. And it takes time to build those skills though, right? To be able to let the voicemail just ring, like the ring, the phone ring and go to voicemail without you feeling that you need to answer it you need to action it immediately. But here's the thing, clients often respect you more if you give them boundaries. Same thing applies. So, once the work stays at work, which is easier said than done though, life does change and.
Trudi Cowan (08:51.393) It does.
Trudi Cowan (08:58.382) Google. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (09:03.564) Yeah, and so will your family.
Mm-hmm.
Sarah Eifermann (09:16.482) It's really hard though, when your husband and wife or partners in a relationship and in business, because you're then in with each other in those after hours. So have you got any tips Trudy for how you would manage that situation?
Trudi Cowan (09:31.31) well you both still have to have a life outside of each other in my perspective. So whether that's hobbies or catching up with friends or doing some other activities you need.
Sarah Eifermann (09:37.369) Mm-hmm.
Sarah Eifermann (09:41.744) So making the relationship the priority as opposed to everything else that goes with the relationship. So that might be regular date night. It might be a regular trip away together. can still, here's the thing though. You can still do both though, right? You could tack on a business planning trip and go away from your traditional living arrangements and work life arrangements. Go away for two nights, have.
Trudi Cowan (09:45.165) Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Trudi Cowan (09:54.83) where you don't talk about work.
Sarah Eifermann (10:10.624) one day spent on the business and then enjoy each other's company and time together and go do an activity.
Trudi Cowan (10:16.629) take discipline and not everyone can do that. So sometimes it does just need to be this is a holiday we're not taking work with us we're switching off and this is just some time around time away with just us.
Sarah Eifermann (10:22.541) Exactly. Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (10:28.186) But again, we're back at setting and allocating some boundaries around what are we going to do? And that can be hard, especially if one person's like, yeah, we're doing this. The other person's like, why are we doing this? Like, this is, I don't want to do this. I just want to talk about what I want to talk about. It doesn't work for everybody all of the time. And so that's that respect and understanding that their love language as to how they absorb and tolerate information when it's not their priority.
Trudi Cowan (10:31.982) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (10:38.638) Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (10:56.164) I think that communication piece is the then again, the main thing that comes into communicating how you're feeling about this. And then seeing behavioral action change on the flip side. If you can communicate to the do you blue in the face, but if there's no change in behavior, your relationship could be on the line. And I've said to customers, in the last six months, your priority is your relationship, not this business. And unless you get on board with
what your partner is currently saying to you. My advice for you for end of financial year will be to close this business down and go and get a job. Because you told me at the start, your priority was your family. That's why you're doing this. That's why you're working so hard. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (11:32.579) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (11:36.322) Yeah, the business is interfering with the family, then maybe you need to make some big decisions. And again, we're not just talking spouses. If being in business with your parents is impacting on your relationship with your parents or with your spouse, well, maybe that's not the right business for you to be in.
Sarah Eifermann (11:48.26) Or your brother? Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (11:54.03) Yeah, absolutely. Which then also leads into the, you know, compensation and fairness argument for paid work for time.
Trudi Cowan (11:58.702) Hmm
And look, this often is in a sibling type situation. Dad, why are you paying him so much more than me? I'm your family member too, but maybe you have very different roles within that business or maybe you're working different hours within that business and therefore your compensation is potentially being reflected by that.
Sarah Eifermann (12:11.568) Ciao bro, ciao bro.
Sarah Eifermann (12:22.478) Yeah. I don't see a lot of family based businesses that have job descriptions or job roles accurately recorded, which then leads into the miscommunication or misunderstanding of who's doing what. But when it comes down to actually awarding compensation for the job role as if you were employing another person, it's very important to have an understanding which then avoids the resentment and avoids favoritism, specifically when there's multiple family members involved in transactions.
Trudi Cowan (12:33.858) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (12:40.13) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (12:50.634) Which takes us back to our earlier point of having clear roles and expectations. If those roles are clearly defined, then the compensation is easily going to flow from them. Or maybe if the expectation is that yes, we have different roles, but we're all going to pay ourselves equally. If that's all set and everybody knows that that's what the plan is and it's very clear, then it takes away some of the stress and pressure around the different ways that people are being compensated.
Sarah Eifermann (13:04.634) Mm-hmm. Yep.
Sarah Eifermann (13:13.902) Yeah. And then we have to have a look at the unpaid work. So I often hear I work in my husband's business. I do all the management, all the books. I did scheduling. I do the ordering and I don't get paid at all. Well, why not? Now some people get a distribution at the end of the financial year and that's completely fine. However, you can forecast what that distribution will be and pay it out weekly.
instead, and specifically for coercive control relationships, which is now a crime in Queensland as well, coercive controls come in only recently as a criminal act. I think it's important for you to understand your own worth in the job role that you do, but also ensure that you are paying yourself the equivalent income that you would be earning if you were doing this job elsewhere. Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (13:43.448) Yep.
Trudi Cowan (14:06.87) There's often tax benefits in doing that also rather than one person receiving all the income.
Sarah Eifermann (14:13.858) Absolutely. It then also helps in the decision making about the business, about the family life, the resentments usually much, much lower. If there's a financial remuneration or a value prop that people can see coming through as well. So
Trudi Cowan (14:23.533) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (14:27.66) Yeah and I think that's, you're right, it's not just the financial compensation. It may be one person's getting a car, another one's not getting a car, one person's having their phone paid for by the business but the other one's not getting their phone paid for by the business. So we're not just talking wages, we're talking all of those other benefits that maybe one or another party of a family member within the business is getting and maybe it's even why is he getting fast-tracked up the promotional ladder.
Sarah Eifermann (14:44.932) Mm-mm.
Sarah Eifermann (14:50.511) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (14:56.578) but I never seem to get recognized for anything that I'm doing and why might I also get those promotions and get advanced within the business as well.
Sarah Eifermann (14:59.162) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (15:05.472) Yeah. And if there's not equal distribution of any of this, like you can have one person doing all the business development work, someone else doing all of the technical work, they're getting paid for their time at the business development side is not income generating as perceived and therefore they don't get paid, but they're doing just as much work. And then that can create all sorts of drama. So I think it's really important to, to in, you know, business does affect personal life and then that does affect.
Trudi Cowan (15:20.184) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (15:32.706) my stick in the
Sarah Eifermann (15:35.242) decision-making dynamics around how you act, how you choose, how you plan moving forward, who has the final say, like where is the hierarchy in this business? Is it an equal partnership? Is it not? I've also had other businesses where it's one person's business, they've then got a partner, the partner's become involved and they now say it's our business. But is it? Or is it still the first
Trudi Cowan (15:42.464) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (15:58.872) depends on actions speak louder and sometimes in those circumstances.
Sarah Eifermann (16:02.48) Correct. So all of these things are really relevant and our part of our previous episodes was on succession planning that again forms into this, but also protecting your asset can be a part of it as well. And then, yeah, there's that risk of.
Putting like the implication of personal life affecting business, business life affecting personal life. And where do you draw the line and put a hard stop on, which is really hard to do when your world revolves.
Trudi Cowan (16:33.205) when you're in it, it is very hard to do. And it comes down to what's your priority? Is the business your priority or is your family the priority? And most people would probably say the family is the priority. Okay, well, if the family is the priority, then how much do you let the business impact on your family before you stop that and go, no, this is not working anymore.
Sarah Eifermann (16:52.9) They would also say out loud what they think the other person wants to hear that may not actually be their truth. And so that is problematic then again, communication if you can't be truthful. But what if the business is their priority and they don't want to be in the home?
Trudi Cowan (16:57.998) That's very true.
Trudi Cowan (17:10.134) Yeah, well then that's something that they need to speak and communicate.
Sarah Eifermann (17:15.364) because that can then impact it. And then on the flip side of that, what if there's an illness? What if there's a divorce? What if a family member has issues? How does that personal life then impact the business? We see this a lot in employees that don't show up for work that day and how that impacts the business. But what if you're mentally or physically unable to be there and be present in the business? You've got staff relying on it.
Trudi Cowan (17:31.085) Yeah.
And what happens if dad's CEO, daughter is CFO and maybe your son is COO and your top three are all out because of an illness or because of a death in the family, right? Do you then actually have senior people within the business that can continue things operating with all of you knocked out?
Sarah Eifermann (17:46.65) Mm-hmm. Family.
Sarah Eifermann (17:55.95) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (17:57.514) Or are you, all three of you, are you the entirety of the business? In that circumstance, what then happens? Go back to our succession planning session, because how does the business then continue to operate if there is a personal matter which affects on everyone, which then is genuinely going to on the business continuing?
Sarah Eifermann (18:04.944) Mm.
Sarah Eifermann (18:15.844) Yeah. And these are the things that a lot of people don't think about. And I know that this episode specifically could be really, confronting for some people listening to it today going, shit. She's calling me out again. I really don't want to be at home. My kids are crazy. They're in that age. And I just, if I'm at work, I don't have to deal with it, but that leaves the other partner in your life, whoever they are carrying the full load, which is completely unfair to them as well.
Trudi Cowan (18:24.727) Mmm
Trudi Cowan (18:29.464) Hahaha!
Trudi Cowan (18:42.87) Yeah. And I guess the other aspect that we haven't actually touched on in terms of the impact on family and business is that maybe your spouse runs a business and you don't.
Sarah Eifermann (18:45.562) Mm.
Sarah Eifermann (18:54.392) Mm-hmm, you have a job.
Trudi Cowan (18:56.518) Do you now have a job because your spouse has business? Does that mean you have to help in that business? I've seen a few jokes online of, you know, my wife started a business and I became the unpaid laborer and they'd be the bloke, you know, helping pack up the orders or whatever the case may be because they help and it's ingest and they're obviously very happy to help their partners. But it may not be ingest. Maybe you are being sort of forced in a way to
Sarah Eifermann (19:02.544) Mm-hmm.
Sarah Eifermann (19:12.471) Yep, yep.
Sarah Eifermann (19:19.033) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (19:23.798) assist your partner in this business that you never really wanted to be part of and then how does that then impact on your personal life as well.
Sarah Eifermann (19:29.892) Yeah. So many different things to consider that most people may not have ever even considered. I do a lot of this type of, strategy and coaching work with, with my business clients. A lot of my business clients are married or in, you know, relationship, husband and wife, or vice versa. And the biggest stresses they usually have is because they haven't considered these things.
Trudi Cowan (19:34.606) Yes!
Trudi Cowan (19:41.004) Hmm.
Sarah Eifermann (19:58.488) And they're not communicating about what these things look like. And then the other side of it, that communication and when it comes to conflict is listening and hearing that other person. Sometimes again, you do need the third party to go, no, no, no, wait, you did not hear her when she said blah, blah, blah, or wait, you did not hear him when he said X, Y, Z and you've steamrolled over their very valid position on something because it doesn't suit your position on it. that
Trudi Cowan (20:01.699) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (20:08.686) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (20:20.472) Hmm.
Sarah Eifermann (20:26.608) conflict resolution piece is really important because how do you solve the conflicts that you're then having in both personal life and business life? Because they will reflect each other.
Trudi Cowan (20:33.068) Yeah. Business. exactly. I was going to say, are you able to put aside the personal conflict walking in the door to your business so that you can actually just get through the workday together and then go park it and then go home and continue your conflict? Is that achievable with you or are you going to take that conflict into the workplace, which if you have other staff is going to impact on those staff, impact on maybe the quality of your work? Lots of variables.
Sarah Eifermann (20:56.818) And so this is the...
Sarah Eifermann (21:01.208) The un, sometimes unappreciated, perspective that comes from a third party is should you be in business and life together? If the conflict is ongoing and it's spilling into every part of your life and you've got staff, is it fair to maintain that? Or should you really just call it for what it is and separate? I've had clients that, their marriage broke down, they split, but they still run a business together. They just.
communicate via like a Teams chat or text messages and they don't, they're very separate in their roles and the business is working fine. And they've just, they've kept their personal life completely out of the business.
Trudi Cowan (21:40.814) So guess in that context, they did decide that the business was more important for them and that the relationship wasn't viable.
Sarah Eifermann (21:46.67) Well, sometimes sometimes you can't sometimes though you can't walk away from the business. Like a circumstance might be that you won't earn as much money in that job role for somebody else as you do from a business that is profitable and trading well. So it makes financial sense to stay in the business even if you don't want to be in the business. That comes up quite regularly. I say that too in some of the Facebook groups I'm in I
Trudi Cowan (22:06.978) Me too. Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (22:13.23) I don't want to be with my partner, but our business is together and I'll never get paid the same amount and I can't survive and pay rent if I'm not earning in the business. So therefore I have to stay, you know, and structure of the business from succession planning again, we'll have a key impact to whether or not you can stay during a relationship breakdown. Because if one person has full control and you've got no shareholding, then you may find yourself.
Trudi Cowan (22:21.806) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (22:39.624) and have no say about whether you continue to stay in that business or not. Which comes back to do you even though it's a family business, do you have employee contracts with your family members? Have you documented the relationship and these remuneration and all of these sorts of things document? I often say to clients that are entering into businesses with either family or close friends, I'm gonna be the bad guy here for a moment. What happens if this doesn't work?
Sarah Eifermann (22:43.532) Correct. So all of these things are very relevant.
Sarah Eifermann (22:51.98) Exactly, like all of these compliance issues.
Sarah Eifermann (23:03.364) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (23:07.596) and you end up in an argument or disagreement about something, okay? This is why we need to document what you are doing and what you agree on now while you're talking to each other. I said, hope that never, I always hope it never happens. But while you are happy, we need to document what do we do in the event that you do decide that this business needs to split or one party needs to leave because you need to agree that now and have that documented now so that if that does happen, at least it takes away
Sarah Eifermann (23:14.704) Mmm.
And what's the exit strategy? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
Trudi Cowan (23:37.799) one more element of that split because it's already been decided.
Sarah Eifermann (23:40.174) I used to say the same thing to when I did residential mortgages to boyfriend and girlfriend. They're going to move in together, but they want to buy a house. So this person's got this much money. This person's got that much money. All right. What's the exit strategy? Who gets the house? If you split, what do you, what? Something you need to consider. One person is contributing more money to this. Have you considered going and getting a binding financial agreement?
Trudi Cowan (23:46.168) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (23:59.662) Mmm.
Sarah Eifermann (24:06.874) to protect your individual interests because you are in the love phase and that's fantastic. And I hope it all works out for you, but statistically it does not. And there is less emotional drain and lag later if you've got a formalized document that actually dictates how you split it then. Right? So these are all the things that actually protect your relationship, rather than hinder it. And for me personally, there's a massive red flag there if one party won't participate.
Trudi Cowan (24:06.904) Yep.
Trudi Cowan (24:15.022) Hmm.
Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (24:23.593) what's going to happen.
Trudi Cowan (24:29.599) and
Sarah Eifermann (24:36.802) in that style of pre-planning because maybe there's another agenda there. Just, you know, something to consider. So again, putting, protecting a relationship is not just about revenue. It's about all facets of that relationship. So business values, family values into the business. Like I have quite a few clients that have, they're very strong on their family values in their business and it has done them really well, but it's also boxed them into a bit of a corner.
Trudi Cowan (24:37.112) Yeah.
Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (24:48.526) Bye.
Sarah Eifermann (25:05.177) when it's come to some of the tough decision making because it doesn't match their family values. being really clear with each other as to what you want that to look like in business and then being able to make the tough business decisions, even though it may not agree with your family values can be an important pathway to have considered as well.
Trudi Cowan (25:09.931) Yes.
Trudi Cowan (25:22.604) Yeah, recognising that when the business is hurting, the family's also going to hurt from that too.
Sarah Eifermann (25:26.404) Yeah.
Everyone's going to hurt. then the other one is like friends when you've hired friends and maybe they're not lifting their weight or maybe you're not in a position to pay them. Like how do you deal with that in advance in terms of performance management? So all of those things are really valuable.
Trudi Cowan (25:33.698) Hmm.
Not so hard, yeah.
Trudi Cowan (25:44.642) Yeah, whenever I've taken on family or friends as clients, I've always made it really clear this is not working. The friendship or the family relationship comes first. You tell me that you'd like to move on and there's no hard feelings. Do it early. I'd rather pass and still be friends than this business relationship cause a problem.
Sarah Eifermann (25:54.479) Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.
Sarah Eifermann (26:03.46) Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And I have seen a lot of relationships end as a result of that inability to communicate. And sometimes it's not you. Sometimes it's the friend that can't cope and can't communicate. So how will you deal with that and stay in your integrity is really important as well, because some relationships unfortunately aren't salvageable, but how do you maintain for your own value proposition? How are you going to handle that in the instance of
Trudi Cowan (26:13.954) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (26:25.582) that.
Sarah Eifermann (26:32.324) What does that pathway look like? How do we deal with this? and things like that. So, yeah, I think it's, it's a tough topic to unpack if you've never considered it, but it certainly gets much, much easier every time you revisit what, what does it mean to work with family, work with my partner, work with my brother, my sister, my friend, my dad, my mom, and how do we make this for the, again,
Trudi Cowan (26:48.846) you
Sarah Eifermann (26:59.44) the best interests of everybody or for the highest good of all concerned. Yeah. Do you have any final tips Trudy? Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (27:01.954) Yeah.
Definitely. Definitely. And as always, it's communication that is really important in these relationships.
Sarah Eifermann (27:14.032) Yeah, absolutely. Again, again, always break down. And like, just as one little tip, something that Trudy and I do, cause we're obviously now friends, we started as work relationship and we became good friends. We talk a lot outside of work, but it's kind of like a bit of an unwritten rule that we've had is that we don't very often bring up work stuff after about 6pm. Like I'm not going to, no, like it just became mutual respect. So I'm not going to ring you unless it's actually something that is really urgent or super important or I need.
Trudi Cowan (27:34.198) No, we don't really do email.
Trudi Cowan (27:42.304) Yeah, and we also have different methods of communication. it's work stuff, tends to be on our email and Teams. If it's personal stuff, it's a phone or a messenger. So we kind of do have a little bit of a divide as well.
Sarah Eifermann (27:44.495) Yeah.
Yep.
Yeah. And if she texts me, I think something serious has happened and she might be dying because texting is we don't text anymore for those reasons. Right. So, it's exactly where I was heading with this. So sometimes separating it out can make it really, and I've actually now pushed this model through with other people that I use. Like if it's a work relationship, I'm going to put you onto a team's chat or whatever the chat is. It's Google chat.
Trudi Cowan (27:54.958) Hahaha!
Trudi Cowan (28:02.518) Yeah.
Trudi Cowan (28:14.336) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (28:16.857) And we're going to talk work stuff in there. And then any of the personal stuff we're going to talk in messenger or on text message or something else. Because also if you're ever looking for any information, it's a lot harder to go through one channel for work and business to find that context of that conversation than it is if they, if you know work stuff is usually only in teams. So there's the little tip that we use. And I think you can still do the same for your family members, your spouse. You can talk your lovey dovey stuff in messenger or
Trudi Cowan (28:29.678) it is.
Trudi Cowan (28:39.182) Definitely.
Sarah Eifermann (28:46.264) a text message, or maybe you use WhatsApp and Teams or something for the business stuff. And it can help. then you also, if it's not urgent, that also means that person doesn't have to reply about that issue.
Trudi Cowan (28:52.778) Yeah, definitely.
Trudi Cowan (29:01.075) yeah, it's very easy to just ignore the team's app and go, well, I'll catch that on Monday when I'm back at work.
Sarah Eifermann (29:05.422) without them personally ignoring you, right? So it helps create a boundary around the personal life and the business life that can be really valuable to the emotional implications of being in relationship and in business with somebody.
Trudi Cowan (29:09.57) Hmm
Trudi Cowan (29:21.806) Exactly right. Look, if anyone else has any additional tips they'd like us to share, please let us know. We'd love to hear how you manage the differing relationships between working with family and spending time with them personally.
Sarah Eifermann (29:24.996) Yeah.
Sarah Eifermann (29:35.917) Always looking for more. Always.
Trudi Cowan (29:38.808) Yes.
Sarah Eifermann (29:40.708) Thanks everyone, we'll see you next time.
Trudi Cowan (29:43.564) Bye bye.